10 Artists Who Aren't In The Rock and Roll Hall of Fame - But Should Be.

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Permalink Reply by Jon Bard on July 7, 2010 at 6:11pm

I generally agree about non-rock and roll artists being put in the R&R HOF. As I like to say, you don't see cricket players in the baseball HOF. That said, i would make a case for the Temptations. Their "psychedelic soul" era resulted in some fabulous music that goes beyond soul and R&B into the realm of truly great rock and roll.

As for hard rock and metal being crap? well, that's your opinion (and one that may be shared by Hall voters, I guess) but even a non-fan of the genre has to accept the importance of Alice Cooper or Deep Purple ('specially if you want to see Grand Funk go in...)

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Permalink Reply by Jon Bard on July 7, 2010 at 9:41pm

If the conversation boils down to subjective viewpoints, it becomes simply an "I never liked those guys but I liked these guys" sort of thing. Instead, I've tried to suss out the HOF's criteria for artists. best I can tell, they seem to reward artists that were either big critical or commercial successes (or sometimes both), who had some longevity and who influenced artists that followed. Obviously, you can list plenty of artists in there who don't quite fit, and that's what makes it so maddening, but, on the whole, that's what I see.

So, looking at it from that kind of objective viewpoint, when you look at artists like Priest, Motorhead, Deep Purple and (especially) Alice Cooper, they all fit. GFR kinda fits, although I'm not sure about how influential they were. But I'm a fan of those guys, so I'd listen to an argument. Again, I think the key to this discussion is to set aside personal tastes and try to see if the criteria that puts, say Blondie or John Mellancamp into the R&R HOF justifies the list above. I think it does.

As for the Tempts -- pick up the Psychedelic Soul comp and get back to me. Obviously it's soulful, but songs like Ball of Confusion, Runaway Child Running Wild and Cloud 9 are miles from "My Girl". If you accept Sly & The Family Stone as rock and roll (and I Do), then this era of the Tempts qualifies too. And it's amazingly great stuff, HOF or not.

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Permalink Reply by Bruce Brodeen on July 8, 2010 at 9:06am

Gawd....yr kidding about Priest, right, Roy?! Slade?! I want to see YOUR Slade records next time in Kansas City!

Actually, I did a little early morning RAWK with my drive this morning - running to get myself some 48th Birthday donuts and brought "Hell Bent For Leather" and "Sin After Sin" in with me - put on "Hell" and it hit me the absurdity that The Priest is still not in there - absolutely undeniable.

Ahhh, sweet breaking a new day tunes. ;-P

We can dream about Motorhead and Joy Division - that won't happen, ever.

Do check out the Temptations recommendation that JB mentioned - it will shock you in its awesomness.

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Permalink Reply by Jon Bard on July 8, 2010 at 10:29am

Hey Allen,

i think the key to having a discussion like this is to set aside the real-world decisions of the Hall and just look at things in a more utopian fashion -- i.e. "who deserves enshrinement as one of rock's most important acts based on quality of music and historical importance". Otherwise, it usually does end up turning into "what the hell is Madonna doing there?"

GFR certainly fits on a commercial level. They were a huge, huge band -- selling out Shea Stadium at their peak. But, truth be told, their albums are really spotty and there were plenty of bands around doing the same thing just as well, if not better (Cactus comes quickly to mind). Like I said, I really enjoy Grand Funk, but I'm not sure they belong in my more utopian (i.e. Madonna-free) version of the hall.

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Permalink Reply by Jon Bard on July 8, 2010 at 10:39am

Yeah, I can picture you all, dressed up in your parachute pants and kajagoogoo haircuts, laughing at some real men who weren't afraid to let their leather freak flags fly. :)

Creative Commons Licensephoto credit: e53

Hell Yeah!

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Permalink Reply by Bruce Brodeen on July 8, 2010 at 11:16am

Hey Hey Allen....

So the Priest is a no go for you, eh? I think the argument for them goes well beyond the personal taste realm, though and there IS a solid logic that they belong. Although, that said, I still wish the HOF would somehow disappear completely so all discussions on all matters related to it would cease.

A for the logic of Priest, I'll leave that for others more sensible folks to present but I will say this.....Judas Priest put forth the modern-day template, an archetype that all future bands would embrace to varying degrees. When they kinda broke in the US in '79 or so(with "Hell Bent For Leather" and the live album), it was a watershed band for hard rock fans who did not have a lot to celebrate at the time(punk, new wave, disco all capturing the attention of media, radio and music fans).

They were a rallying band - the British rockers in NWOBHM movement pretty much were inspired by JP and those bands' future success have had massive impact on the music business, as whole. Post-Sabbath, they are a Rosetta Stone for hard rock and heavy metal - don't have to dig the 'tude, the leather but their influence on a larger audience being exposed to heavy metal is rock solid.

I've never been much a fan of the output of the band that really broke them into the mainstream, actually - "British Steel" was my ending point for them, but you can mention the name to almost anyone not even into music and they have heard of the band, know what they sound like and have an strong opinion on whether they like them or not. They've seeped into culture-at-large and provide identifying points for a very important genre of music. Even a band like, say, Metallica can't say that - they have one single that the everyman has heard, tops but nothing to match the most popular 3 singles of JP(always strange attaching the word 'singles' to a heavy metal band - just feels icky)

I really like YOUR list, Allen - I can get behind all those are personal faves(sometime, I'll have to share my weekend w/ Rick Nielsen and Bun E. Carlos in Rockford pitching a project for my label....hysterical and ridiculously amazing!). I'm a HUGE Rory Gallagher fan, not only owning everything in his catalog but boots to boot. I watch DVDs of his playing and get weepy. You talk to UK rock fans in the 70s, almost all mention Rory as being a larger-than-life presence in their world, a rock mensch concerned only with putting on the best show possible for his fans.

T. Rex? AMEN! Marc is one NEVER bantered about in forums on this subject - if influence on fans and musicians helps in the process, T. Rextacy '71-'74 in Europe and the UK has been rarely matched since. I had that TANX poster on my wall until I left for college in '81. In a matter of months in 1973, through the genius of Creem magazine, my first exposure to Bolan, Iggy, MC5 and The Dolls changed my 11 yr old world. Forever.

James Gang? Big 'ole stretch for the HOF but "Walk Away" is one of my all time favorite songs and - you'll like this - along with those Priest CDs I have in my car right now, I have "Rides Again" in the mix. Small World Story: Played a tennis match against an old marine who fought in Vietnam last week - talking to him afterwards and he was talking about playing in a band in high school in Jersey. The guitarist in his band? Joe Walsh. He went off to 'nam....he comes back in '69 and catches up w/ Joe at a JG concert and was amazed at how insanely great he had become w/ his guitar playing. Joe was really, naturally, really cool w/ him and took care of him for the night but that's another story.

Cracked me up. Playing in your high school band w/ Joe Walsh. That freakin' rocks.

Bless you for mentioning Badfinger - a hallmark band for me and one that put me on the path to be doing what I've been doing w/ running my label and online store for the last 16 years(notlame.com). Great book on the band called "Without You" by Dan Matovina - really rare now, but if you find it ever find, a really moving and engaging read.

Grand Funk Railroad too many people forget were THE biggest band in the land for 2/3 yrs. Spotty albums, I have them all but I pull them all out with scary regularity. Ever listen to "Good Singin', Good Playin'", the one produced by Zappa? "Can You Do It" is one of my favorite GF songs.

All right, gotta get back to work here....geekin' out.

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Permalink Reply by Jon Bard on July 8, 2010 at 11:34am

A Rock and Roll hall of Fame that includes Ratt is a Rock and Roll Hall of Fame I'd like to visit. :)

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Permalink Reply by Bruce Brodeen on July 8, 2010 at 5:12pm

Robin Trower? Total geek for him - Literally, I own everything w/ his name on it and was listening to a 1974 bootleg last week that had Reg Isidore still playing drums w/ him(I prefer Bill Lordan). In fact, I got in touch w/ his manager some years back as I exploring doing a box set of his for my label. I had just completed one for a band called Jellyfish and had a licensing arrangement with EMI so I was looking into both Sweet(don't get me going) and Trower.

XTC group?! DO it, sir! Today. I'm in. I'm a bit odd - the album of theirs I play most often is "Go2".Did you get the reissues from last year of the DUKES albums? premium job.

Badfinger: star-crossed? Under-statement, beyond a blanket statement of sad. So yr a power pop geek? Well, that's been my professional full-time gig for 16 years at Not Lame. Kick the tires w/ it before it goes away in a few months....starting a new site for power pop geeks. Drop me an email at: bruce@notlamecustomercare.com and I'll get you on the update list.

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Permalink Reply by Bruce Brodeen on July 8, 2010 at 9:59pm

I saw Trower in '78, too! A few times after that, but that was my fave year of seeing him.....

Vinyl? Yeah, I schlep(literally) around 2,500 LPs still. Just moved most of them from Not Lame storage into my home - build shelves inside the garage all the way around so I can store all that kind of stuff(Man, I have a serious book problem, too..). CDs? Don't ask - that's beyond sick. The purge begins this summer, though.....

I'll check my email in the morn - shut down for work on my birthday for the rest of the day(48 today). Look forward to it, sir!

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Permalink Reply by Steve :overing on July 9, 2010 at 3:25am

Bruce Brodeen said:

Robin Trower? Total geek for him - Literally, I own everything w/ his name on it and was listening to a 1974 bootleg last week that had Reg Isidore still playing drums w/ him(I prefer Bill Lordan). In fact, I got in touch w/ his manager some years back as I exploring doing a box set of his for my label. I had just completed one for a band called Jellyfish and had a licensing arrangement with EMI so I was looking into both Sweet(don't get me going) and Trower.

XTC group?! DO it, sir! Today. I'm in. I'm a bit odd - the album of theirs I play most often is "Go2".Did you get the reissues from last year of the DUKES albums? premium job.

Badfinger: star-crossed? Under-statement, beyond a blanket statement of sad. So yr a power pop geek? Well, that's been my professional full-time gig for 16 years at Not Lame. Kick the tires w/ it before it goes away in a few months....starting a new site for power pop geeks. Drop me an email at: bruce@notlamecustomercare.com and I'll get you on the update list.

Happy birthday Bruce. I'm with you on XTC but as you say Bruce this is never going to happen. Andy Partridge is turning into a true English eccentric and still producing great work with his Fuzzy Warbles collection.

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Permalink Reply by Steven Eric Wilson on July 9, 2010 at 12:31pm

First off - screw the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame. Come to my apartment and visit Steven's Rock & Roll Hall of Hell Yeah! It's much cooler and you won't have to be bored to death by Eric Clapton (sorry EC fans, I just don't get it).

The first inductees into the Hall of Hell Yeah are -

1. The Jazz Butcher - my alltime favorite band.
2. The Posies - so powerful they could turn goat piss into gasoline
3. Sam Phillips - not the Elvis guy...the angelic woman with the angelic voice who was once married to T-Bone Burnett
4. XTC - do I need to explain?
5. Nick Cave & The Bad Seeds - the house band for Dante's inferno.
6. Lloyd Cole - a real, hardcore, troubadour
7. Judy Sill - should have been bigger than Carole King
8. Echo & The Bunnymen - "am I the shall in potential...or am I the suck in cess"
9. Aimee Mann - the female Elvis Costello
10. Elvis Costello - the male Aimee Mann

the inductee concert will be happening very soon - in my living room. most artists wont be able to show up for the ceremony/concert but will be represented by old, dusty, vinyl records.

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Permalink Reply by Bruce Brodeen on July 9, 2010 at 12:53pm

Right On Steve!

I tend, generally, to be into female singers - never 'got' Aimee Mann, Jill Sobule, Sam Phillips but I DO 'get' Judee Sill. I read a review somewhere in the late 70s right after she died, found the 1st album and thought it was brilliant. Surprised there's not been a movied-based-upon or documentary on her. We we talking about Badfinger earlier with stars being crossed - Judee, sadly, was dealt a messed up blow.

The Jazz Butcher?! Right on! I acted in a short movie in LA in the early 90s and the director used a few of his songs in it - perfectly. He's good friends with one artist on my label.

Nick Cave: Brilliant description - House Band Of Dante's Inferno. Gawd, dig his whole body of work(I bought those Birthday Party albums on import when they came out but, man, I just was 'not ready' for them back then..) but the right mood is hard to find to listen to him regularly.

Lloyd Cole's first solo record - what was the early 90s - is one THE most under-rated, ignored albums of that time. It should have been all over the radio. I interviewed for a job at Capital a few months before that record came out - I had a series of interviews, one of them was a project to design a campaign upon - I chose this one from the upcoming projects and thought I nailed it. Well, had a few more interviews, someone else got the job - who chose some silly pop/rap singer, long forgotten. Hey, helped me start me own label a few years later....WHICH released a box set in 1999 of one of your all-time fave bands, The Posies. Sweet!

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